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Post by Maddog on May 23, 2021 23:31:52 GMT -5
I would agree everything about this case considering how brutal it was- screams personal. When I see serial killer or thrill cases where a child is also killed, it's not usually that brutal where they're also blugeoened to death. Maybe they're sexually assaulted unfortunately, but they're not beaten violently with a weapon. For example, Robert Fisher allegedly killed his kids in a brutal manner- but it was believed to be as a "F U shot to Mary". This case would suggest that Ruby's son was also killed for personal reasons. Your observation is extremely intelligent. This does "scream personal."
I strongly doubt drugs were involved. For three reasons: 1) Even though marijuana was found in the trailer, none of the victims had marijuana in their systems, and there are no other indications they were involved in the sale of drugs. I doubt a pregnant 30-year-old victim like Elaine is going to be smoking pot while pregnant; 2) I remember seeing a show once with a cold case out of Iowa where the victims were savagely beaten to death (nowhere near as bad as this case) in a trailer. They asked a retired detective if he felt the case was drug-related and he very quickly said no. He reasoned that in the drug-related homicides he had seen, the killer(s) usually very quickly killed the victim and fled the scene just as quickly (and invariably, a gun was used all on victims). While Keith was shot, the remaining victims were bound, gagged, and beaten; and 3) Nothing in the background of the victims indicates they had sold drugs. They were church-going, and Keith was trying to raise money for his son's college fund through non-nefarious methods.
Your point about a thrill killing and serial killing is also a good point. The fact that Keith's penis was severed and never found: that is something I have never seen in a thrill killing or any serial killer case.
One of the investigators in 1997 felt that there were two possible motives: 1) Drugs; 2) Sex-related.
I am leaning towards the second. There was some discussion on Reddit (and I agree with this), that this could have been someone who was rejected as a lover by one of the victims at some point, someone who was incredibly jealous of their relationship, or there was a tryst of some kind going on. Again, I am not trying to malign any of the victims: I want that to be absolutely clear. Any three of these sub-theories would account for the incredible amount of rage involved. If it is someone who was previously connected to either Elaine or Keith through a past relationship, they would have had to have convinced a second person to help in the killings (which is the only problem with this theory, but stranger things have happened - it's possible that the primary killer (assuming there is more than one killer) was able to find someone else who really hated the Dardeens.
A person from a prior relationship could also account for: 1) Keith's severed penis (this motive is the only reason I can think of anyone mutilating his genitals); 2) The lack of forced entry (keep in mind, a woman in distress did try to access the Dardeen trailer to use their phone, and Keith wouldn't let her in, either Elaine or Keith would recognize a former lover); 3) I could see this accounting for the killer(s) killing the newborn, as well. The reason is, they could have seen the newborn as a product of Keith and Elaine's relationship and that would have set them off.
It's easy for me to figure out why there was no forced entry: the killer(s) flashed a gun at one of the victims and that gained them access. We know a gun was used in these homicides. I have very little doubt as to how the killer(s) entered, and after further discussion, I suspect that a sex crime or a jealous lover was the motive.
The killer(s) had to be from the area. It's the only thing that makes sense to me.
Re-publicizing this case will help big time, and a reward may help, too. New leads may help uncover evidence not previously known (for instance, when William Bradford Bishop was added to the Ten Most Wanted List, it was learned he was having an affair at the time of the killings).
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Post by Maddog on May 26, 2021 17:36:39 GMT -5
I apologize I am bouncing around on this, but I found an old interview with the detective assigned to this case. I thought from media reports that Sells had just guessed and guessed and got questions right when speaking with law enforcement. Apparently, that wasn't the case.
He apparently told law enforcement other facts known only to them, and told them things they previously didn't know and they verified that information. The detective said he believed that Sells was the primary suspect.
I would love to know what Sells said so it could be verified, but I doubt that will ever be revealed since the case is still open. Apparently, he also told more than one account of how he got into the trailer. I find this account to be a possibility: He apparently had some beers to dull his nerves (a trick often used by Ted Bundy) and then approached the trailer which had the "For Sale" sign and told Keith he wanted to purchase it. Keith was suspicious, and that's when Sells forced his way in and all hell broke loose.
I am not necessarily doubting the detective, but to reach the same conclusion he reached that Sells was the likely killer, I would hope that this was information that Sells knew without any guesses. I suspect that some information is still being withheld, but information I have found in recent articles includes that: A) The killer or killer(s) left the baseball bat inserted in Elaine's vagina before leaving; B) Elaine's breasts had been mutilated. I am wondering if those were facts not previously disclosed that Sells knew.
If it was Sells, I had two questions that I think could be answered by people in this forum:
1) Is there confirmation that Sells was in the area at the time? This may be hard to determine since A) Sells is dead; and B) He was a drifter, and;
2) Is there any documentation that Sells ever tried to clean-up a crime scene? I do have trouble with the fact that he had a low IQ and that he seemingly would not leave any physical evidence behind at either murder scene.
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Post by Scumhunter on May 26, 2021 18:48:08 GMT -5
Unfortunately don't know the answers other than Sells doesn't feel like this case for reasons we already mentioned- but it is telling if he knew things never released.
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Post by Maddog on May 26, 2021 20:06:24 GMT -5
Unfortunately don't know the answers other than Sells doesn't feel like this case for reasons we already mentioned- but it is telling if he knew things never released. Do you think from what you have heard about the case that they could find any DNA samples from the scene after all these years?
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Post by Scumhunter on May 26, 2021 22:19:22 GMT -5
Oh definitely. I know familial DNA is all the rage these days but even regular DNA they seem to keep advancing. The Golden State Killer cases they were able to link him as the East Area Rapist/Original Night Stalker thanks to just plain DNA advances before they even caught him with Gedmatch.
I'm sure there has to be some DNA they can test.
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Post by TheWebDetective on Jul 12, 2021 16:50:48 GMT -5
Here are a couple of videos from the Youtubers Savannah Brymer and Swamp Dweller about the case.
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Post by Maddog on Aug 28, 2021 22:57:29 GMT -5
Oh definitely. I know familial DNA is all the rage these days but even regular DNA they seem to keep advancing. The Golden State Killer cases they were able to link him as the East Area Rapist/Original Night Stalker thanks to just plain DNA advances before they even caught him with Gedmatch. I'm sure there has to be some DNA they can test. Even with Y-STR DNA, it could link Sells to the crime (if he did commit it like some investigators suspect). Y-STR DNA is not as definitive as traditional DNA, but it does show probability (example, odds of a match for one suspect could be 1 in 800). I have my doubts that Sells committed this crime for various reasons, but one of them is that I do not think he was smart enough to cover his tracks like the investigators have said the killer(s) may have done (we know the murder weapon at the trailer, the baseball bat, was wiped clean). If a match through Y-STR DNA is obtained through the FBI database, the FBI will not share the results, because federal law requires them to keep donors anonymous. They are already in a heated battle with investigators in Texas because they will not turn over the Y-STR results in the Austin Yogurt Shop Murders when there is a match.
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Post by Maddog on Nov 27, 2021 21:03:36 GMT -5
For the first time ever, investigators have revealed the information that Sells knew that led to them suspecting he was the killer: www.kmov.com/news/gruesome-murder-of-an-illinois-family-remains-unsolved-as-the-main-suspect-is-executed/article_6ed620fa-3cf7-11ec-9209-6f50780a16d7.amp.htmlSells knew that inside of the trailer, there were ceramic watermelon plates that were in plain view. An independent investigator they brought in (renowned for his work in clearing countless people who turned out not to have committed crimes they were originally accused of) was convinced Sells was indeed the killer based off of this information. His reasoning was that only someone who had been in the trailer could have known that. The local sheriff also reached the same conclusion. Sells claimed he waited off the property drinking beer when he then went into the trailer and killed Elaine and Peter and Elaine’s newborn child. He then surprised Keith who arrived later and killed him at the different area. Thoughts on this? That does seem like specific information. I can’t help but wonder if he had help, though. Reason being: there is evidence that the killer tried to clean the scene, and I have never heard of Sells doing that.
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Post by Scumhunter on Nov 27, 2021 23:32:05 GMT -5
I know this is probably not a useful answer, but there is evidence pointing both to and against Sells.
About a possible theory it was a woman or someone short in stature- from what I've looked up Sells is 5'9" and 195 lbs- so not a small stature but not like he's an NFL linebacker either and relatively average physical frame.
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Post by Maddog on Nov 28, 2021 1:05:47 GMT -5
I know this is probably not a useful answer, but there is evidence pointing both to and against Sells. About a possible theory it was a woman or someone short in stature- from what I've looked up Sells is 5'9" and 195 lbs- so not a small stature but not like he's an NFL linebacker either and relatively average physical frame. No, I get that. I’m wondering if someone else helped Sells in perpetrating the crime. I don’t think Wells was smart enough to clean up the crime scene (the old AMW.com post indicates that one of the murder weapons, a baseball bat, was completely clean for fingerprints). From what I know of Sells, he was pretty sloppy in committing his crimes.
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Post by Maddog on Aug 31, 2023 20:02:40 GMT -5
WARNING/DISCLAIMER: VERY graphic information ahead.
Bill Clutter is the investigative director of a National program called, "Investigating Innocence", which helps indigent inmates who are wrongfully convicted. He has helped get innocent people off of death row.
Tommy Lynn Sells was a possible suspect in that separate case. He revealed very gruesome information in the affidavit. He stated that Keith's penis was not only severed, but it had been stuffed into his mouth.
He said that one year after the killings, he was assisting a law firm (as their investigator) in a drug trafficking case. He mentioned the Dardeen killings, and that client indicated that he had heard rampant rumors that the killings were drug-related. Interestingly, Keith's car was parked right in front of the Benton, IL Police Department, and right next door was the Federal Courthouse. There had been a major drug conspiracy trial there in mid-1986.
The Affidavit alleges that Keith had been an informant regarding drug trafficking in Western Indiana, and that he and his family were killed by Tommy Lynn Sells (who was working for either the Mafia, Sons of Silence Motorcycle gang, or both) to "send a message."
Sells was interviewed about this by Clutter, and Sells told him that he lied about originally telling police that he either killed Keith due to Keith asking him to engage in sex with Elaine, or that he knocked on the door and inquired about the sale of the trailer. Clutter claimed that Sells' demeanor changed, and he said that he lied because he didn't want the police to think the killing was linked to organized crime. It's alleged that Elaine may have worked for a pizza parlor where the owner had ties to the Sicilian Mafia, and that may be one way Keith gathered information about the possible drug trade. This all happened during the "Pizza Connection case" in New York and elsewhere where drugs, including heroin, were distributed through pizza restaurants which were used as a front.
The other murder case I have been referring to was the case of Dyke and Karen Rhoads in Paris, IL (which is about 150 miles from Ina, IL). It has been suggested that the Sons of Silence organized the Rhoadses murders, and Tommy Lynn Sells was implicated by Clutter as committing that crime. The horrifying part: Dyke Rhoads' penis was severed and stuffed into his mouth. There was another similarity between the Rhoads and Dardeen case: two Budweiser cans were found in close proximity to the Rhoadses home. I think I posted this previously, but Sells claimed he drank beer cans in the woods near the Dardeen home before the crime. Remember as well: Sells remembered a detail about the Dardeen home that hadn't been made public: watermelon ceramic plates in plain view. The ceramic plates detail is what led Clutter to believe that Sells did indeed kill the Dardeens.
I would also note that one of the investigators in this case stated that he believed one of the two possible motives was drugs.
I have previously suspected that Sells was not involved, but I am starting to believe he was responsible. The beer cans and the mutilation just seem too eerie to ignore as far as similarities go. Additionally, Clutter obtained information that Sells was working as a drug mule in the Midwest at the time.
I would also note that in 1997, Keith Dardeen's mother indicated she was worried about "reprisals" against her family, and in this affidavit, another family member said she was worried about the Mafia. What I am wondering: if this was a mafia/motorcycle gang hit, why target an entire family instead of just Keith? A murder of an entire family is going to bring a lot of unwanted attention. I do believe this is a very plausible theory, and I do believe now that Sells was involved (I want to stress, I don't believe the Dardeens were trafficking drugs - I doubt Keith wanted drug activity anywhere near his son). If all of this is true, the question is not who committed the murders, but who ordered them.
Thoughts?
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Post by Scumhunter on Sept 2, 2023 17:00:10 GMT -5
This murder seems personal but Sells did kill as if it was personal. So who knows. I didn't think initially it was Sells, but you're very convincing now.
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Post by Maddog on Sept 2, 2023 23:21:38 GMT -5
This murder seems personal but Sells did kill as if it was personal. So who knows. I didn't think initially it was Sells, but you're very convincing now. The reason I had trouble believing it was drug-related was because: 1) There was no hard evidence the Dardeens were involved in trafficking drugs; 2) Their autopsies came back squeaky clean for drug use; and 3) Drug-related homicides in the US rarely result in overkill: the perpetrator committing the murder usually wants to leave the scene as fast as possible. The crime does match the brutality of Sells’ slayings, and I am fairly certain he was involved (although previously I suspected it was someone else and then was unsure). However, I cannot help but wonder if he had help in cleaning the crime scene up. The old AMW profile indicates the murder weapon at the trailer, the baseball bat, was absolutely void of any fingerprints. Judging from the affidavit, it appears that the killer used duct tape and took the bindings with them. Sells was of below average to average intelligence (there are various sources indicating his I.Q. was between 80-100), and I don’t think he would cover his tracks so easily, so I suspect he had some help. What really leads me to believe the drug angle: the car being parked in front of the Benton Police Department and the Federal Courthouse. What better way to scare off other witnesses who may cooperate later? The fact that the killer was so brazen to park the car there tells me that they have done this before, and had absolutely no problem taking risks. Again, I don’t believe Keith nor Elaine were active in the drug trade because they wanted Peter safe, but I cannot help but think they knew they were in danger from Keith’s possible informant work. I suspect this because: 1) We know Keith wouldn’t let a young woman into his trailer six months before the murders when all she wanted to do was make a phone call; and 2) Keith told his mother he was going to relocate soon, even if he hadn’t found a new job. I will give Keith’s family the benefit of the doubt that they have absolutely no knowledge of Keith’s possible informant activities, but it seems extremely odd that in at least two instances, they indicated that they were worried about reprisals, and in one instance, of the Mafia. One thing I didn’t mention: at one point, Sells refused to talk to Bill Clutter any further, as indicated in the affidavit. I can’t help but wonder if he did so because he was worried he would imperil himself if he kept talking (he did tell Clutter he lied to police so that they didn’t think it was connected to organized crime). One thing I think everyone can agree on: this is one of the worst (if not the worst) homicide cases in American history just from the brutality aspect. To beat a child and a pregnant woman with a baseball bat, watch her deliver her child, and then to beat the newborn child to death with a baseball bat, and then take the father, shoot him three times in the face and then sever his penis and stuff it into his mouth… it’s beyond satanic. I really want to see this case solved just to know whether or not a living demon still walks among us. If the killer or the person who ordered these killings is still out there, we should be scared out of our wits.
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